In our class discussion and readings, it was all based around "Mantic" and "Sophic". As we delved more into those words and discussed what both meant, I tried to follow each idea and comment that was made but what resulted was just a jumbled mess in my mind. For some reason, I just couldn't get my mind around what mantic and sophic really was. So I decided that for my post this week, I would do my own research and bring my own interpretation to what those words mean.
So to start of my own delving into the core of Mantic and Sophic, I figured the formal definitions would be a good place to begin.
Mantic: of or relating to divination or prophecy.
Sophic: a deliberately invalid argument displaying ingenuity in reasoning in the hope of deceiving someone.
After reading those definitions, I couldn't think of where to go from that...
So I proceeded to repeat both words multiple times.
"Mantic..Sophic..Mantic..Sophic..Mantic..Sophic..Mantic..Sophic..Mantic..Sophic..Mantic.."
It became kind of a chant or mantra of some sort. A few minutes after just saying this words out loud, two words emerged that helped me know what exactly to look up next.
- Romantic
- Philosophic
Romanticism. At first glance, divination and prophecy don't adequately describe this period well. But if you can find a deeper meaning in divination, it can actually provide an excellent description of the time. Divination is essentially the seeking of knowledge of the future or unknown by supernatural means. Supernatural has so many connotations. Being religious, obviously what first comes to mind is a higher power, Heavenly Father, Jesus Christ, etc. But then comes to mind are witches, wizards, Harry Potter, magic, and all variety and extensions of those.
The Romantic period was a time where great works of art, music, and writings came about. Along with the Enlightenment, it was a time when the seeking of new knowledge was most desired.
One big aspect was the imagination.
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| *Any reason to put a Spongebob picture in is an excellent reason* |
"The imagination was elevated to a position as the supreme faculty of the mind. This contrasted distinctly with the traditional arguments for the supremacy of reason. The Romantics tended to define and to present the imagination as our ultimate "shaping" or creative power, the approximate human equivalent of the creative powers of nature or even deity."
[link to quote]
The mind is what makes humans different from all other creatures on this Earth. In Dan Brown's most recent book The Lost Symbol, (warning: spoilers) it has a conclusion of sheer brain power fueled by the billions of people that live on this planet as a higher power. So if you use some of that philosophy toward the Romanticism period, divination can actually accurately describe the essence of that time.
Interesting connection for "Mantic" order of things
PHILOSOPHIC
I won't be examining all philosophers since the beginning of time, but I decided to look more into Aristotle. Prof. Petersen's discussion of Aristotle's philosophy of women's role intrigued me so much that I decided to research into it more.
Brief overview of what was discussed in class:
- woman were only the vessel of bringing forth children
- men superior being
- boy produced = right
- girl/deformed child produced = wrong
A common theme I noticed when looking into Aristotle was the emphasis on form and matter.
He believed in all organisms of life containing the potential (matter) and the reality (form). Example: a block of stone. Reality..it's a block of stone. Potential to become whatever a sculptor makes it into.
This was also applied to Aristotle's philosophy of slavery. He essentially said that some people were naturally meant to be owned by others. It was in their nature to be slaves.
This was also applied to Aristotle's philosophy of slavery. He essentially said that some people were naturally meant to be owned by others. It was in their nature to be slaves.
‘That person is by nature a slave who can belong to another person and who only takes part in thinking by recognising it, but not by possessing it. Other living beings (animals) cannot recognise thinking; they just obey feelings. However, there is little difference between using slaves and using tame animals: both provide bodily help to do necessary things.’ - AristotleThis same principle was applied to women and men as well. Women were inferior for not having the ability to produce semen. The man was the one who provided the substance of a human. Women were basically just factories for babies. (credit to Michaela Busath, my roommate, for the genius of that sentence)
‘It is the best for all tame animals to be ruled by human beings. For this is how they are kept alive. In the same way, the relationship between the male and the female is by nature such that the male is higher, the female lower, that the male rules and the female is ruled.’ Aristotle's philosophy, while flawed, was very much widely accepted. 
[But personally, while I understand the importance and impact philosophers have had on history, I think they are rather...annoying. To me, they are a bit self-righteous. Just personal opinion. I won't go too much into that..]
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Back to the basic definitions of Mantic and Sophic. When looking at them just by meaning alone, it really is difficult to understand these order of thoughts. But when I decided to delve more and research the history of periods that seemed to exemplify these thoughts, it made it so much more clear to me.
My final conclusion of what those 2 words mean:
Mantic is the desire of expansion of knowledge and have the mind essentially become a 'higher power'.
Sophic is the teaching of personal beliefs, but very well thought out and seemingly solid proof and reasoning to back them up.
So, if anyone else was confused by both Mantic and Sophic, hopefully this brings some light to the meaning. Although, I'm not sure how many people think like I do so perhaps this brings more confusion.
So there's my little adventure I had on a Saturday afternoon..result: more Knowledge! Which is the point..right?
It is really weird how the whole men being better than women thing has persisted for so long. Men definitely are different than women but it is the differences that make it so that life is able to continue. If men's attitudes were the only ones that existed then the world would have already killed off the population in an all out war. Women are the people who keep things going and keep life moving.
ReplyDeleteThanks for the post Shuan! I was also pretty confused during that in-class discussion and I liked your perspective on the topic. And going off of Montana's comment I think it's really interesting how special the period of history we're living in is with regards to gender equality. In the last few decades we've seen huge advances and changes in how society views women that have been rare if not basically absent throughout thousands of years of human history.
ReplyDeleteMantic: a deliberately invalid argument displaying no concrete evidence in the hope of deceiving someone.
ReplyDeleteSophic: of, relating to, or full of wisdom
Shuan, I'm not sure where you got your definitions from, but it reflects your biased attitude on the subject. I have included my own definition in an attempt to show neutrality. ;)
I think that the sophic (even in the sense that Hugh Nibley was using it) has more to do with logical explanations and reason. The sophic mindset attempts to explain everything around us with mechanisms and natural laws. I wouldn't say that it's necessarily a bad thing, since we can now do many things that weren't possible in the past thanks to our understanding of how the universe works. The sophic mindset has allowed us to ask "why?" and find answers.
I admit I had trouble being unbiased in any of my posts. I actually looked up multiple definitions and they all were relatively the same, I just picked the ones that were worded smartly.
ReplyDeleteAnd I have nothing against sophic at all. I just decided to focus on Aristotle's philosophy for that portion. I briefly explained Aristotle's basis behind all his philosophies for "form" and "matter" but I guess I didn't add enough emphasis on those.
The interesting thing about this post is I'm actually no Feminist at all, but throughout this post, it impressed on me that I was taking such a Feminist stance. While I believe women do have rights and should be equal, but that's what I feel all people should be allowed. I didn't bother to take in account the time period and what limited knowledge they had at the time of the workings of man and woman.
I think that defining mantic and sophic, along with many other words, naturally has a bias to it. Many people feel that one path for knowledge is superior to the other and they let that color everything they say about the other. Few people tell it with real BALANCE. Jake said it well that there are good things about each way of viewing the world, especially in modern times.
ReplyDeleteThanks Erin! You expressed my thoughts exactly!
ReplyDeleteEven though I approached sophic and mantic definitely with my own view, I'm totally open and accepting still to others' opinions on the matter.